Parents?
Sometime last weekend a gang of about 20 youths in Wigan beat a Chinese take-away owner to death outside his shop. The first thing to consider is that these youths were in the 14/15 year old bracket. The second thing to consider is that they were not all boys.
They beat him for a full 15 minutes with tree branches and bars until he was in a coma then ran off and left him to die.
Murdering little shits.
I have several thoughts about this sort of thing which is occurring on far too regular a basis. Excuse me in advance for ranting.
It takes 20 of them to beat up 1 person. This shows them to be the yellow-backed, cowardly bastards that they truly are. I’ve noticed that this is a common trend amongst the under-30s. They haven’t the guts to take somebody on 1-on-1. They might lose. No. They wait until they have half a dozen mates with them just to even up the odds.
There were several girls involved. It bothers me that these vicious little sluts are probably going to become mothers with their own kids to drag up and that this will probably happen in the next 12 to 24 months. Yet more single parents that the poor tax-payer is going to have to fund.
Most of the gang have been arrested then released on bail. I assume this is due to their age as I’m sure anyone over 18 who was suspected of murder would have been locked up. Well I’m sorry (no I’m not) but I don’t care how young or old they are they should be locked up too.
And here is the biggie. I’ve no doubt all the namby-pamby liberal cretins out there are going to blame this kind of behaviour on society. All I can say to you is
Bollocks!
I’m a member of that society and it is no fault of mine. The fault lies full-square on the shoulders of the parents. Parents who are probably piss-heads or drug-addicts or criminals or prostitutes or just plain sluts. Parents who enjoyed their 5 minute shag but couldn’t be arsed to take precautions because that would be responsible wouldn’t it? Now that they have kids they can’t be bothered with parental responsibility either. Oh no. Raising their kids is the responsibility of the school isn’t it? Or the government isn’t it? Or Social Services isn’t it? Or anybody except the parents isn’t it?
Stop-press News!
No it frigging isn’t. Parenting is the responsibility of parents. No-one else. If you want sexual pleasure you’d better take precautions or be ready to take on your parental responsibilities. There is no excuse for shirking them WHATSOEVER!
When the courts have dealt with this little mob of fuck-wits (thanks Podz) they should go and drag the parents out of bed and put them away too. Maybe future parents would start to sit up and realise that society isn’t going to take this shit lying down any longer.
Comments ( 28 )
Recently there was a news story about a group of kids who watched and/or participated in the sexual assault of a mentally challenged girl while they were IN SCHOOL.
It’s enough to make you want to move to the moon.
Here’s the rub though. Because it seems that the police and other more civilised parents, probably with children at more civilised schools, can’t seem to believe what teachers are saying, one teacher took it upon herself to go into class with some hidden cameras and expose precisely what sort of behaviour they have to put up with from pupils. This has recently been aired on TV. All pupils faces were blurred out so that they couldn’t be recognised.
That teacher, who I think has performed a great public service, is now being vilified by the very teachers who were complaining about the violence at their conference, including the union’s leaders.
I simply cannot comprehend such double-think.
**“When the courts have dealt with this little mob of fuck-wits (thanks Podz) they should go and drag the parents out of bed and put them away too. Maybe future parents would start to sit up and realise that society isn’t going to take this shit lying down any longer.”** your quote.
In my last semester, I took an 2nd year undergraduate philosophy class, which was an elective for me. In one of the essays that we had to critique, was the argument that; “should the government intervene with parents and issue licences for having children.” The grand scheme of things was, that under all the ideologies, (accept fascism or fundamentalism ???) the government should not interfere with the family process, but only act as either enforcer if social norms are broken or violated, or, as a means of social support, welfare or agency that helps disadvantage children when the family unit fails. Since the Liberal model dominates the British system (as it does here in Canada), I highly think that it would socially or morally unacceptable for the government to even conceive the idea of that level of control.
However, having said that, YES!!!, the community should, and by all accounts, hold the parents responsible for any wrong doing that their children cause. The question now, that needs to be answered, is by what degree should the patents be held accountable for their children’s action?
Case one: if a child breaks a window, what restitution should the parents be held accountable? (hint-summary conviction)
Case two: if a child murders someone, what restitution should the parents be held accountable?(hint-indictable offence)
Case 2 is a different kettle of fish. For me the child should go to court and if convicted should serve the same sentence any adult would get for it. As far as the parents are concerned, if it could be proved that they have been neglecting their duties as a parent, and let us not forget that some kids can turn bad even with good parenting through other outside influences such as bad friends, then there should be some kind of offence such as parental neglect, and if found guilty they too should be locked up though not for the same amount of time of course.
What will really annoy me is when the big-mouth namby-pambies get on the case and start blaming the society we live in or TV or computer games. It’s a load of crap. There are tens of millions of people in this country who don’t put a foot wrong yet we all live in that same society, most of us watch TV and a few million play computer games. It’s a futile argument. In fact it isn’t even an argument. They don’t have a leg to stand on but because these big-mouths will be Lord or Lady so-and-so, or MPs or someone well known they will be listened to. Pfft.
Not to mention the pipes I keep trying to squeeze into! :wail:
Hehe.
I thought it was only the young American generation that was so lost, irresponsible, self-centered, and without concience.
Teachers over here face the same issues, and their right to punish misbehavior has been steadily diminished. My daughter’s teachers only recourse is to order a student to go to the Principal’s office where the secretary will simply call the parent out of work to come pick up their child.
I’m not saying that teachers should have to punish students – they shouldn’t. The parents are responsible for ensuring their children know how to behave properly and have respect for the authority of teachers, elders, etc. But if the kids do act up, the teacher should have the option of doling out immediate, appropriate punishment.
When I was in school boys and girls alike would be subject to an ass-whipping if they behaved rudely enough. And were liable to get second one when they got home.
Contrary to the conclusions of numerous “studies”, I did not grow up to be a violent criminal, spouse or child abuser, nor do I suffer from what is called “low self-esteem”.
You are quite right there Root, one senile old fart will send them down and another will let them out again!
I have a hankering to bring back the stocks. Locate them right in the middle of the main shopping areas of towns. A good use for rotten or genetically modified tomatoes methinks. I think it might shame people into behaving themselves and reduce the prison population by having an alternative for petty crimes. Not for these little buggers though. Throw the damn key away I say.
I’ve always thought that prisoners get off quite lightly as things go. For me I’d like to see some of the good ol’ American traditions brought over like prison farms and chain-gangs. Make the beggars do something useful like feed themselves or road maintenance and help pay back their debt to the society that those namby-pambies are going to blame for them being there in the first place.
That said, I certainly won’t be letting my kids run amok and act like hellions.
Stuart – I just needed a whimsical change. I’m sorry it’s making the world collapse. I had no idea I held such power! Must be the loins! XD
Whilst I definately hear what you’re saying Stuart, there’s no way I’d like to see a return to corporal punishment. I’ve never hit my daughter, there’s no way in hell I’d let somebody else do it. That would just be ‘ruling through fear’, and I think, quite rightly, we’ve moved on from that. There are other far better ways to produce well behaved kids.
Mutual respect would be a start. Respect does work both ways. All too often I see parents where it seems the only form of communication they have with their children is very aggressively shouting at them. And we wonder why events like the above happen. How would you feel if the only attention you got as a child was being shouted or swore at?
That’s the core problem, the lack of parenting skills. Or in some cases, the lack of a desire to even learn those parenting skills. It’s a sad situation and breaks my heart.
And this does not occur only in single parent households. I myself was a single parent at 19 years of age, and I managed just fine. They’re not all irresponsible 15 yr old ‘sluts’ as the media would have you believe.
Tom and Zenith – I agree with you that the sensationalism of the press makes this kind of thing seem more prevalent than it truly is but I also say that once is once too often. The trouble is that it is far more than once isn’t it? This kind of gang-beating happens every single day somewhere in the country. It may not result in death, and even if it does, it may not make the national papers, and it is mostly done by teenagers.
All – Let me bring something I didn’t mention in the article into the discussion. The guy that died owned a Chinese take-away and the beating happened after he had closed-up. Now most take-aways are open until about 1.00am at the weekends, often later, plus you have to allow extra time for tidying up etc. before the shop is locked-up for the night. That suggests that it may well have been around 2.00am when the beating took place. What the hell were 14/15 year olds doing out at that time? I can assure you that when I was that age my parents would have been worried sick and would probably have been ringing up the police by mid-night asking them to go and find me, and I can also assure that that I would have done the same for my kids too.
Now this is nothing to do with the article but re-enforces the point. My eldest lad is stopping with me at the moment for reasons I won’t go into here. He’s 32. He goes out at the weekends, usually clubbing. At 2.00am I’m still wondering where he is despite his age. He can look after himself but you never know do you? As it happens he tends to text me when it’s getting really late to let me know where he is and what time he thinks he will be back. That’s good but he isn’t 14/15 is he? Catch my drift?
Now I used the word sluts in the article which tends to carry a certain sexual differentiation with it. I did not intend to make the girls seem any worse than the boys. For me they are all sluts. OK? My problem is that it is the girls who will get pregnant and have kids. Yes, I know it takes two to tango but I would suggest that the type of boys they are currently hanging out with are the very type who will bugger off at the first sign of trouble leaving the girls to cope with any babies on their own. I don’t have a problem at all with single parents in general, male or female, but I would suggest that these girls will be the very type that I do have a problem with.
I have other things to say but it is Sunday and I need to go shopping before the shops shut so I’ll get back to it later.
I also understand the power of media to take something small and insignificant and turn it into the most critical issue facing the world today (not saying that the issue in question is small or insignificant).
Statement: Juvenile crime is not growing, nor is it getting better, but, it is staying constant throughout recorded history of human development and though to today, as we speak. Another words, regardless of what the media perceives and the constant bombardment of media waves, compounded with political and social structure that are in constant flux, all point to kids-out-of-control therefore kids are NOT reforming to social policy based on economic, gender and race but rather children need to be controlled in a crime control manner. The kids have stayed the same, it has being the social contract (to use Mills analogy) that has changed.
This cycle that I talked about before is a 100 to 150 year cycle that is current going thought it’s next phase of metamorphosis. In Canada we have gone from a strict controlled juvenile policy of treating children exactly like adults. You may recall some stories in classical literature that depict children getting hung for their crime just like adults, or as in some cases, along aside adults. The Elizabethan time were particularly hard on orphaned children or abandon (street) kids who were suffering from the boom of the industrial revolution. So from the 1820s to 1920, children were no better off than adults as far as punishment goes. In Canada, the youngest person to be hanged in 1882 was a 10 year old girl who was charged with killing her father. One can only speculate that her crime was probably self defence from being raped?
1920 to 1984 we move into the Welfare Control Model in which the state now takes control of children, as it proclaims that it has the ultimate goal of raising children, especially those who are from disadvantage homes. the law in Canada was called the Juvenile Delinquency Act of 1919. This gave the state the power to take children away from parents and put them in boarding homes or reform repositories. This is were we get children services from social welfare agencies.
1984 to 2003 we have the Young Offenders Act which works a crime control mechanism and punishes children by reverting back to harsher punishments and raising children to adult court for serious crimes. For the most part, we assume that we are still living in this era because not to many people know that the new legislation now exists?
Today, we have the Youth Criminal Justice Act(2003) that is supposed to break the cycle of Juvenile crime as we know it. Will it work, stay tuned?
My point here is that only the laws have changed, not the kids. Kids will be kids. We as adults have a responsibility to our children. Laws are not going to fix them as we see fit, but rather the onus is on us to guide them, protect them and raise them responsibly. The only thing the cycle does not fix is society, another words, perhaps it is our lifestyle or economic displacement that is the cause of all of this? Maybe living in apartment complexes is not such a good idea for raising children? But in the end, it is our responsibility to care for them and give them everything they need to grow and become responsible members of society. And remember this—you were all once children too!
Absolutely! And thanks for the insightful posts.
But as for these kiddoes, when they cross that societal line and KILL another human being, then they forfeit their right to be viewed as helpless children. They are far from it.
And I don’t want to hear lame excuses about how your mommy or daddy didn’t pay enough attention to you, you weren’t breast-fed, the computer age, TV, the media and video games trivialize human life, etc., etc., etc. I don’t care how you were raised, you know as a human being that it is WRONG to kill another.
Blaming society as a whole gets us all off the hook too easily. It should start and stop with the parents. And yes, too many children are having children. They are ill equipped financially or emotionally to take on the responsibility of another human being.
One has to wonder how such bloodlust can be instilled in children at such a young age? I grew up watching the Vietnam War on TV. I saw the ravages of war, death, destruction. It did not make me want to go out and kill. Never has and never will. And perhaps it was because I was raised “by the belt” (my mother didn’t call it child “rearing” for nothing). It’s RESPECT that is lacking here. Respect for one’s parents, respect for authority, respect for human life. Sad, sad indeed.
And it all starts with the small things that parents should teach their children.
Out of all the kids my daughter’s age that I regularly see, how many of them do you think answer me with “yes, sir” or “no, sir”?
3.
And one of them is mine.
By age 15 we may still be children but we certainly know what we are doing. Even the dumbest prick in the world knows that kicking someone continually will probably not do them a lot of good and will most likely result in death.
And they give them bail. Until the system changes what hope is there?
I do not see anything bad in people teaming up in order to accomplish something. It is a sign of positive social behaviour, and it is well spread among other mammals too, down even to the whales.
The fact that these young guys and girls team up for a goal that is not properly sane, is a different thing.
Also, the fact that they definitely deserve many years of hard working camp inside a jail (working, not sitting on a bed), despite their young age, is a different thing.
but hey you can’t blame the parents, it’s the tv they watch, or the games they play or the music they listen to. our little johnny is a good little boy that wouldn’t harm a soul. always buys a mother’s day card and so on and so forth.
racial attacks for me were normal, i was used to it to some extent but the law cannot do anything about it. slap an asbo on them, watch them take the tags off and buy a bottle of cider from mr patel, drink till the evening then terrorise an old couple who are simply heading home. yeah i’ve intervened and paid for it in more than once instance but the truth is no one cares. that is no one in power cares. how do you tell parents that they’re crap at parenting without alarming the “good” parents and teachers.
at the same time, you’ve seen how they slap a fine on a parent for the kids behaviour. what’s a 10 quid fine worth? the cost of someone’s life? the cost of harassment and a it of bottle throwing at people walking by?
the world is screwed, and i know i’m being pessimistic, but if people thought that the last generation would make the world a better place, then look where we are now. still the same stupid decisions, still the same blame game. is it going to get better? well these kids are the future, and they will breed.
it’s depressing just to think about it